I also think this is an excellent article. The assembly is for the saints, not for evangelism. Also, taking advantage of emotions in a "captive audience" is not right nor fair. Unchurched or non-Christian visitors should be impressed with God as they observe our assembly. Anyone coming forward to be baptized probably should have been baptized before the assembly (c.f. "that very hour") -- why wait? We have too many traditions that have enough tenure that we have made them "law" to our detriment. As Gary Anderson below said, "We need to be like the Bereans," and we are not doing a good job of that with our traditions.
great thoughts on this, and insight. I agree that this feels odd coming from a standpoint of trying to be like the 1st century church. It's tradition, of course, and I think it's a better idea, as you say, to invite people to talk with someone privately ( unless they want to make a public confession).
I feel bad for really good preachers who think that they didn't give a good lesson unless someone comes forward!!!
People can also be shy and not know who to go to or even who to ask to go to if they have questions...in most denominations the preacher is also the pastor or priest, so maybe we have the tradition of going to the preacher for most things too...hm. more tradition I suppose.
Kudos to the previous commenter David for also calling our gathering an assembly, as it is called in the New Testament.
Good food for thought. I am in a denomination where invitations weren't routine/rote, but you weren't surprised if the pastor called for one, either. Yet, I haven't seen one for the last 25 years, and I don't think my pastors suddenly saw the light.
People have changed, and so has their foundational knowledge. Whether inside the church or outside, you could talk to the unsaved and more times than not, you could at least get the person to say, "Yeah, I know I need Jesus, but I'm just not ready." Nowadays, you get something like, "Right and wrong? It's all relative, man." We have to invest a lot of time, years even, to put really basic truths into their mind and heart. Because more often than not, the parents, grandparents, schools and more just haven't done it. The culture has purposefully dumbed people down.
Conception and birth, either physical or Spiritual are intimate and private transactions. The modern altar call is like a salesman closing a sale. These are accounted for like sales stats.
Excellent! Why do we seem to have to have a "closing prayer"?
I have had the same thought since I was young, but if you bring something like this up very few/almost no one wants to get into it. How sad. We need to be like the Bereans.
You missed the point. Do we have to have a "closing prayer"? No, yet there is nothing wrong with having one. The reality is that there are members of the church who would get their nose bent out of shape if they did not have one.
At my congregation we have baptized a number of people during the week, not necessarily on the Sunday. The most important thing is the people learn what they must do to be saved. Not all sermons may directly address the issue. Also the invitation is a reminder for all of us of the sacrifice that our Lord made on the cross. Remember, there are individuals who come to worship service that don’t know of our Lord’s sacrifice.
For me the invitation is an emotional part of the sermon. Maybe I’m too emotional? I say no. When you think about what the Lord has done for you, you should show some emotion too.
With all that said, is the invitation biblical? I can’t find it, but it addresses a number of biblical verses that lead to salvation. Let me ask, is this website or all the many podcasts out there biblical? Maybe, maybe not, but I find Focus Press and GBN helpful to my walk with the Lord. As a person raised in the Church who questions a lot of things, I find the invitation not an issue to be questioned. I’m more concerned that the Lord accepts my worship to Him, and that my life style leads the non believer to Him.
Just my two cents - praying and asking for forgiveness is vital, but confessing to other Christians is also commanded. Still, I don’t think James meant we had to do it in front of everyone. Talking to an elder, minister, or spiritual mentor is probably the best path in most cases.
Agree that formal and persistent “altar calls” are a curious practice.
Over the decades I have come to believe that most people do not know what they Believe (about God/Christ/Faith) until they leave their parents home and move from theoretical to actual engagement in Life.
What follows is an excerpt from an upcoming Stack wherein I describe the dawn of my conversion experience. I was 38 years old at the time:
—•
I was confined at home, unable to work, having injured my right hand in a fit of rage after yet another failed relationship. As the days dragged on, I became aware of a fleeting sense, a curious vaporous thought, a whisper of an idea.
I could not nail down what “it” was. But “it” came into my mind that I needed to talk to God. And “it” persisted.
—•
The “Call” to an Altered life was from the Holy Spirit. Finally I was enabled to hear it—when “conditions” and timing were Right.
Excellent! I’ve never thought about this! The assembly is for the saints you talked about in another article, never thought about that. I’ll be re-reading these articles. Thanks so much!
Interesting - I saw CC's article and participated in their survey. Truthfully, the topic seems a tad overblown IMO. I see the invitation as simply that - an invitation. "If you have a need or a concern to share with the whole group, you're invited to do so. If you want to learn more about God's saving power through Jesus and want to let someone know, you're invited to do so." That sort of thing. I include the idea of a private conversation as well. It seems like a "do it if you want to" sort of thing that has value - not as a command or a "have-to" thing over which we should be drawing lines. (Although I know of an eldership who asked their preacher to offer an invitation and he refused...and there were problems!) ((It also seems like we sometimes search for minutiae about which to argue!))
That being said, in regard to Acts 2, I agree with you. 2:38 is a response to their question. BUT - 2:40 sounds a lot like...an invitation. I guess it's up to the guy in the pulpit to read the crowd and determine if you have enough folks outside of Christ in the assembly who need to hear "be saved from this perverse generation" to issue the invitation to them.
I also think this is an excellent article. The assembly is for the saints, not for evangelism. Also, taking advantage of emotions in a "captive audience" is not right nor fair. Unchurched or non-Christian visitors should be impressed with God as they observe our assembly. Anyone coming forward to be baptized probably should have been baptized before the assembly (c.f. "that very hour") -- why wait? We have too many traditions that have enough tenure that we have made them "law" to our detriment. As Gary Anderson below said, "We need to be like the Bereans," and we are not doing a good job of that with our traditions.
I appreciate you calling our gathering an "assembly" and not a worship service.
Good points, I agree
great thoughts on this, and insight. I agree that this feels odd coming from a standpoint of trying to be like the 1st century church. It's tradition, of course, and I think it's a better idea, as you say, to invite people to talk with someone privately ( unless they want to make a public confession).
I feel bad for really good preachers who think that they didn't give a good lesson unless someone comes forward!!!
People can also be shy and not know who to go to or even who to ask to go to if they have questions...in most denominations the preacher is also the pastor or priest, so maybe we have the tradition of going to the preacher for most things too...hm. more tradition I suppose.
Kudos to the previous commenter David for also calling our gathering an assembly, as it is called in the New Testament.
Excellent article. I will have to rethink this subject. You gave me a great deal of insight on the topic and I find no flaws in your thinking.
Glad to hear it!
Good food for thought. I am in a denomination where invitations weren't routine/rote, but you weren't surprised if the pastor called for one, either. Yet, I haven't seen one for the last 25 years, and I don't think my pastors suddenly saw the light.
People have changed, and so has their foundational knowledge. Whether inside the church or outside, you could talk to the unsaved and more times than not, you could at least get the person to say, "Yeah, I know I need Jesus, but I'm just not ready." Nowadays, you get something like, "Right and wrong? It's all relative, man." We have to invest a lot of time, years even, to put really basic truths into their mind and heart. Because more often than not, the parents, grandparents, schools and more just haven't done it. The culture has purposefully dumbed people down.
This is a great point. Not unlike the difference in responses in Acts depending on the culture.
A much needed discussion, especially for those of the Baptistic flavor
Conception and birth, either physical or Spiritual are intimate and private transactions. The modern altar call is like a salesman closing a sale. These are accounted for like sales stats.
Indeed they are. Good point.
Excellent! Why do we seem to have to have a "closing prayer"?
I have had the same thought since I was young, but if you bring something like this up very few/almost no one wants to get into it. How sad. We need to be like the Bereans.
I don't see the closing prayer as being analogous to the altar call. What is the objection?
You missed the point. Do we have to have a "closing prayer"? No, yet there is nothing wrong with having one. The reality is that there are members of the church who would get their nose bent out of shape if they did not have one.
At my congregation we have baptized a number of people during the week, not necessarily on the Sunday. The most important thing is the people learn what they must do to be saved. Not all sermons may directly address the issue. Also the invitation is a reminder for all of us of the sacrifice that our Lord made on the cross. Remember, there are individuals who come to worship service that don’t know of our Lord’s sacrifice.
For me the invitation is an emotional part of the sermon. Maybe I’m too emotional? I say no. When you think about what the Lord has done for you, you should show some emotion too.
With all that said, is the invitation biblical? I can’t find it, but it addresses a number of biblical verses that lead to salvation. Let me ask, is this website or all the many podcasts out there biblical? Maybe, maybe not, but I find Focus Press and GBN helpful to my walk with the Lord. As a person raised in the Church who questions a lot of things, I find the invitation not an issue to be questioned. I’m more concerned that the Lord accepts my worship to Him, and that my life style leads the non believer to Him.
Does this mean I have to go to the front to repent or can I pray and ask for forgiveness?
Does this mean I have to go to the front to repent or can I pray and ask for forgiveness?
Just my two cents - praying and asking for forgiveness is vital, but confessing to other Christians is also commanded. Still, I don’t think James meant we had to do it in front of everyone. Talking to an elder, minister, or spiritual mentor is probably the best path in most cases.
Agree that formal and persistent “altar calls” are a curious practice.
Over the decades I have come to believe that most people do not know what they Believe (about God/Christ/Faith) until they leave their parents home and move from theoretical to actual engagement in Life.
What follows is an excerpt from an upcoming Stack wherein I describe the dawn of my conversion experience. I was 38 years old at the time:
—•
I was confined at home, unable to work, having injured my right hand in a fit of rage after yet another failed relationship. As the days dragged on, I became aware of a fleeting sense, a curious vaporous thought, a whisper of an idea.
I could not nail down what “it” was. But “it” came into my mind that I needed to talk to God. And “it” persisted.
—•
The “Call” to an Altered life was from the Holy Spirit. Finally I was enabled to hear it—when “conditions” and timing were Right.
Excellent! I’ve never thought about this! The assembly is for the saints you talked about in another article, never thought about that. I’ll be re-reading these articles. Thanks so much!
Can you give any supports for your views on the possible negative outcomes?
Interesting - I saw CC's article and participated in their survey. Truthfully, the topic seems a tad overblown IMO. I see the invitation as simply that - an invitation. "If you have a need or a concern to share with the whole group, you're invited to do so. If you want to learn more about God's saving power through Jesus and want to let someone know, you're invited to do so." That sort of thing. I include the idea of a private conversation as well. It seems like a "do it if you want to" sort of thing that has value - not as a command or a "have-to" thing over which we should be drawing lines. (Although I know of an eldership who asked their preacher to offer an invitation and he refused...and there were problems!) ((It also seems like we sometimes search for minutiae about which to argue!))
That being said, in regard to Acts 2, I agree with you. 2:38 is a response to their question. BUT - 2:40 sounds a lot like...an invitation. I guess it's up to the guy in the pulpit to read the crowd and determine if you have enough folks outside of Christ in the assembly who need to hear "be saved from this perverse generation" to issue the invitation to them.
Keep up the GREAT work!
Very good, except I did not get one point: What is a Dicksonite?
We're both based in the city of Dickson, TN. I realize now that probably would be confusing to someone who's never heard of it, sorry!
Thanks! I was afraid it was some new faction, like "One Cup but you are allowed to have a church kitchen" or something like that. :-)