Great article Jack. Churchianity is weak on contending for our faith, particularly in our modern Laodicean churches. We appeal to our senses, right where Satan operates. We ignore Satan at our peril.
Some good thoughts here. Some -- although to be fair, not nearly all -- of the elders I've seen who are considered qualified because they have at least 1 child who is considered faithful (it seems because they go to church regularly) with some of their other children to be fallen away are shown to not really be the spiritual leaders that the church needs. We need men in those positions who are truly spiritual men, and how they've raised their families is one of the indicators of their spiritual maturity.
However, I do think that there is more to the equation than what you've brought out. If I understand your article correctly, you equate being qualified - i.e., being the spiritually mature man needed for the job - with all of the man's children being shown to be faithful. You dismissed the objections that brought out Isaac and Samuel, noting (correctly) the biblical record of their fallacies in parenting. I think their parental weaknesses should not be ignored and stand as an example to us today.
Yet what should also not be ignored is that God later in Hebrews 11 specifically cited them as examples of faithfulness -- specifically, steadfast faithfulness in the face of severe adversity (vs. 33-38) -- in spite of the less-than-stellar parenting.
In fact, the faithfulness God cited within Isaac specifically had to do with him "invoking future blessings on Jacob and Esau" (Heb. 11:20), an act he did while simultaneously on that same occasion practicing the very favoritism you correctly cited as an example of one of his failings as a parent (Gen. 27).
God also cited Samuel, albeit in a more generalized way, as an example of faithfulness (Heb. 11:32), in the immediate context of citing examples of those who showed loyal, unwavering faith to God in the face of severe hardship and persecution (vs. 32-38), a trait we definitely need in elders. He did this in spite of Samuel's clear shortcomings as a parent.
David comes to mind as well. "A man after God's own heart," also cited in Hebrews 11:32 as an example of strong faith, a prophet whose psalms God put in Scripture as an example of a strong, intimate relationship with God, a man who was said to keep God's commandments and statutes, "doing only that which was right in (God's) eyes" (1 Kings 11:34; 14:8) and who was also said to "not turn aside from anything that (God) commanded him all the days of his life, except in the matter of Uriah the Hittite" (1 Kings 15:5). Yet 2 Samuel and 1 Kings show that David, like Samuel, was not the best parent in that his children as adults all seem to have, sooner or later, fallen away from God (Absalom, Solomon, Adonijah, Amnon; I can't think of any of David's children who are clearly shown to be faithful, can you? Tamar, perhaps?). Since God, in spite of how his children turned out, said that David, with the exception of the Bathsheba episode, did only what was right in His sight and did not turn aside from any of His commandments, then is it not a reasonable conclusion that David did do his best to "bring his children up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord" (Eph. 6:4), and yet they still rejected his teaching later in life?
With those biblical examples in front of us, it seems to me that we should strive to find spiritually mature men for elders of whom it is clear that all of their children are faithful per Titus 1 and 1 Timothy 3. You make good points towards that end. Yet at the same time, these biblical examples before us here should cause us to pause and not automatically dismiss them as not qualified if they do have faithful children...albeit less than the complete number of their children could be said to be such.
I believe there will always be times and places in which qualified elders are not present, yet the Christians will still need to meet. Ideally it would only be for a short period, though.
Understanding “Short period of time” to be subjective, your response raises several questions for me. May we assume a short period is not years on end?
In our state, WV, most congregations are small to very small and historically a large percentage have not had elders.
Finding ourselves in this situation and acknowledging this as a problem, how do we work our way out of this generational mire?
Traveling to a congregation with elders can for some be an option. Keeping God’s providence in mind, praying for and working toward a solution can be another option. What does working toward a solution look like here? Combining local congregations may be a solution. If five area congregations have one qualified man per, then the problem is solved. If zero are qualified per then . . .
Finding a congregation with elders does not necessarily equate to finding a congregation with qualified elders. I am beginning to envision a group of nomads with their flocks of sheep wandering from place to place looking for a home ☺️.
One of the origins of our problem is desertion producing splinters which perpetuate desertion by providing numerous options for desenters.
VERY REAL PROBLEMS
NEED REAL SOLUTIONS
And what by necessity must be part of these real solutions? LEADERS
This enters the realm of subjectivity more than some of the other points, so this is just my take, but I think even if the kids are at home the proof can be taking root. I've been around baptized elders' kids who were enthusiastic participants in the church, and I've been around baptized elders' kids who were present but entirely disengaged. As for the age... obviously "elder" is not strictly referring to age, but the wisdom that comes with age should be part of the role. 45 is the lowest end. Again, all my opinion.
So God gives us all free will to choose. Christians strive to be like Christ but we will never be perfect. Our children leave home and make choices, if we as parents like it or not. I for one would not be a Christian today if I followed the pattern and teachings of my parents. Choices. They didn’t like my choice but I did it and continue to live a Christian (not perfect) life.
We are not “cut from a mold” we are not to be just “checking off the boxes” we are to strive to be Christ like.
I would venture to say as men strive to be the best Christian men they can be there would be a lot more elderless congratulations if they stepped down when a child becomes unfaithful.
Striving always striving.
And just as a side bar here in reference to the contractor. The house doesn’t have free will. People do.
Jack, couldn't agree more with this article. Seems to be a minority opinion in the church, but it shouldn't be.
Great article, Jack. Can’t argue with the Word of God. Thank you for all the great articles and all the good you do.
Thank you!
Great article Jack. Churchianity is weak on contending for our faith, particularly in our modern Laodicean churches. We appeal to our senses, right where Satan operates. We ignore Satan at our peril.
Appealing to our senses is such an important point in all this, you’re exactly right
Some good thoughts here. Some -- although to be fair, not nearly all -- of the elders I've seen who are considered qualified because they have at least 1 child who is considered faithful (it seems because they go to church regularly) with some of their other children to be fallen away are shown to not really be the spiritual leaders that the church needs. We need men in those positions who are truly spiritual men, and how they've raised their families is one of the indicators of their spiritual maturity.
However, I do think that there is more to the equation than what you've brought out. If I understand your article correctly, you equate being qualified - i.e., being the spiritually mature man needed for the job - with all of the man's children being shown to be faithful. You dismissed the objections that brought out Isaac and Samuel, noting (correctly) the biblical record of their fallacies in parenting. I think their parental weaknesses should not be ignored and stand as an example to us today.
Yet what should also not be ignored is that God later in Hebrews 11 specifically cited them as examples of faithfulness -- specifically, steadfast faithfulness in the face of severe adversity (vs. 33-38) -- in spite of the less-than-stellar parenting.
In fact, the faithfulness God cited within Isaac specifically had to do with him "invoking future blessings on Jacob and Esau" (Heb. 11:20), an act he did while simultaneously on that same occasion practicing the very favoritism you correctly cited as an example of one of his failings as a parent (Gen. 27).
God also cited Samuel, albeit in a more generalized way, as an example of faithfulness (Heb. 11:32), in the immediate context of citing examples of those who showed loyal, unwavering faith to God in the face of severe hardship and persecution (vs. 32-38), a trait we definitely need in elders. He did this in spite of Samuel's clear shortcomings as a parent.
David comes to mind as well. "A man after God's own heart," also cited in Hebrews 11:32 as an example of strong faith, a prophet whose psalms God put in Scripture as an example of a strong, intimate relationship with God, a man who was said to keep God's commandments and statutes, "doing only that which was right in (God's) eyes" (1 Kings 11:34; 14:8) and who was also said to "not turn aside from anything that (God) commanded him all the days of his life, except in the matter of Uriah the Hittite" (1 Kings 15:5). Yet 2 Samuel and 1 Kings show that David, like Samuel, was not the best parent in that his children as adults all seem to have, sooner or later, fallen away from God (Absalom, Solomon, Adonijah, Amnon; I can't think of any of David's children who are clearly shown to be faithful, can you? Tamar, perhaps?). Since God, in spite of how his children turned out, said that David, with the exception of the Bathsheba episode, did only what was right in His sight and did not turn aside from any of His commandments, then is it not a reasonable conclusion that David did do his best to "bring his children up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord" (Eph. 6:4), and yet they still rejected his teaching later in life?
With those biblical examples in front of us, it seems to me that we should strive to find spiritually mature men for elders of whom it is clear that all of their children are faithful per Titus 1 and 1 Timothy 3. You make good points towards that end. Yet at the same time, these biblical examples before us here should cause us to pause and not automatically dismiss them as not qualified if they do have faithful children...albeit less than the complete number of their children could be said to be such.
Is it scriptural to have a congregation without elders? Pardon me if I have missed your addressing this earlier.
I believe there will always be times and places in which qualified elders are not present, yet the Christians will still need to meet. Ideally it would only be for a short period, though.
Understanding “Short period of time” to be subjective, your response raises several questions for me. May we assume a short period is not years on end?
In our state, WV, most congregations are small to very small and historically a large percentage have not had elders.
Finding ourselves in this situation and acknowledging this as a problem, how do we work our way out of this generational mire?
Traveling to a congregation with elders can for some be an option. Keeping God’s providence in mind, praying for and working toward a solution can be another option. What does working toward a solution look like here? Combining local congregations may be a solution. If five area congregations have one qualified man per, then the problem is solved. If zero are qualified per then . . .
Finding a congregation with elders does not necessarily equate to finding a congregation with qualified elders. I am beginning to envision a group of nomads with their flocks of sheep wandering from place to place looking for a home ☺️.
One of the origins of our problem is desertion producing splinters which perpetuate desertion by providing numerous options for desenters.
VERY REAL PROBLEMS
NEED REAL SOLUTIONS
And what by necessity must be part of these real solutions? LEADERS
Would you say then that a man with children still at home or if he is under the age of +- 45, he shouldn’t be an Elder because he hasn’t been tested?
This enters the realm of subjectivity more than some of the other points, so this is just my take, but I think even if the kids are at home the proof can be taking root. I've been around baptized elders' kids who were enthusiastic participants in the church, and I've been around baptized elders' kids who were present but entirely disengaged. As for the age... obviously "elder" is not strictly referring to age, but the wisdom that comes with age should be part of the role. 45 is the lowest end. Again, all my opinion.
So God gives us all free will to choose. Christians strive to be like Christ but we will never be perfect. Our children leave home and make choices, if we as parents like it or not. I for one would not be a Christian today if I followed the pattern and teachings of my parents. Choices. They didn’t like my choice but I did it and continue to live a Christian (not perfect) life.
We are not “cut from a mold” we are not to be just “checking off the boxes” we are to strive to be Christ like.
I would venture to say as men strive to be the best Christian men they can be there would be a lot more elderless congratulations if they stepped down when a child becomes unfaithful.
Striving always striving.
And just as a side bar here in reference to the contractor. The house doesn’t have free will. People do.
I would refer you back to the section on free will above.
“If parenting is not training children how to use their free will to choose right over wrong, what is it?”